affirmative action

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is a policy that is harmful to all involved. Whites lose out by not getting in, and blacks and hispanics lose out by being put in a situation where they are likely to fail.

one of the few policies that can be said to harm virtually every group in a different way Obviously, whites and Asians lose out when you have preferential admission for black students or Hispanic students but blacks and Hispanics lose out because what typically happens is the students who have all the credentials to succeed in college are admitted to colleges where the standards are so much higher that they fail.'

is not reverse discrimination because, definitionally, to repair the effects of unfair treatment based on morally irrelevant characteristics (i.e. Discrimination), it is necessary that these same characteristics be invoked in the remedy, and necessarily in a 'morally relevant' manner (i.e. Definitionally non-discriminatory manner).

Nickel argues that affirmative action does not involve reverse discrimination because the preferential treatment involved in affirmative action for purposes of reparations is not based on a morally irrelevant characteristic. For example, if it is decided to apply affirmative action measures as a form of reparation to benefit members of a group who have been discriminated on account of their race, the differential treatment is not based on an irrelevant characteristic, but on the fact that members of that group were treated unfairly because of their race. While the original act of discrimination was indeed based on a morally irrelevant characteristic belonging to a particular race affirmative action measures are not based on a morally irrelevant characteristic having been treated unfairly because of her race. The characteristic which was the basis of the act of discrimination is thus, according to Nickel, not the same as the characteristic which is used to extend preferential treatment under affirmative action programs. Hence, affirmative action measures cannot be regarded as discrimination in reverse.

is responsible for expanding the new black middle-class, but it does not really apply to the poor and working class for whom downsizing and de-industrializing is occurring.

The problem is that affirmative action could never really get at the issue of corporate power in the workplace, and so you ended up with the downsizing... you ended up with de-industrializing. You ended up with the marginalizing of working people and working poor people even while affirmative action was taking place, and a new black middle class was expanding. Cornel West

is historical justice in that it aims to offset the fact that there has been a whole set of informal affirmative actions for white males (exclusive clubs, associations, ivy league schools) where important business is transacted to the benefit of the members and to the exclusion of people who are not.

I'd be interested in your comment has to not been throughout our history a whole set of formal informal affirmative actions for white males for Episcopalians for graduates of Ivy League colleges supporting your presence mr. Buckley ah has there not in fact again in clubs uh ah I suppose I'm not sure what I should include myself I went to Columbia oh yes what about clubs like the century Association in this city the Bohemian Grove Duquesne Club the their various clubs which are engaged in affirmative action for limited groups of their own members in all of these clubs important business is transacted to the benefit of the members and to the disc exclusion of people who are not as we found a permit of action of all coins in this country address to the interest of the stronger groups now comes a moment in our history when affirmative action for a bit is it vans dove for the benefit of groups which have been traditionally at the short end of the distribution of good things in our society and there is considerable repulsion against it isn't it's just a bit of historical justice that's being

is wrongheaded in that it makes people who are badly off worse off in the name of advancing them.

I'm afraid I simply do not see the justice in making people who are badly off worse off in the name of advancing them

 accounts for a profound change in a society arousing enormous patients across the board and the burden of proof for its success should be on those who think that this is beneficial.

I think that when one makes a profound change in a society arousing enormous patients across the board that the burden of proof should be on those who think that this is beneficial because I have been listening very carefully and you have yet to hear the benefit to disadvantaged blacks that has been empirically discovered after affirmative action

 has caused such furor in this country and has gotten people, even allies, at each other's throats with no sense of a need to advance the empirical evidence to support what you've been doing.

there is never any sense of a burden of proof on you to say when you've made this change that has caused such fury or in this country and has gotten people at each other's throats including people who have been allies in the past such as blacks of the Jews there is never any sense of a need for you to advance the empirical evidence to support what you've been doing

is wrongheaded, as exemplified by Malaysia where despite pushing it for years, it has done nothing for the poor melees and no sees them worse off.

that in Malaysia where they've had affirmative action for the same amount of time has had the same results it has done nothing for the poor melees the lowest level of melees receive a small percentage of all the income received by Malays today and before this program then before this program was put into effect as it's true of blocks tonight is it worthless to do something for anybody but the very poor I would like to see the well-off take care of themselves if they can't who can thank you very much a professor of Cashman thank you very much professor Thomas Oh you Up

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